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Lincoln Investments Participant Directed Platform


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#1 krow36

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Posted 22 December 2016 - 04:56 PM

Boglehead poster A440 has been contributing to a Lincoln Investments 403b called “Retirement Solutions Participant-Directed Platform” (PDP) for over a year. The PDP is a Platform for those who do not want or need any help from a rep or an advisor. A440 is using Vanguard Admiral class funds and there is no Management/Wrap fee (as in their Retirement Solutions Premier Platform). There’s a $35/year Account Fee. BH poster Coolstavi has also signed up for the 457 PDP recently. Lincoln Investments’ 403bcompare info does not include the PDP, nor does Lincoln’s website mention the PDP. 

https://www.boglehea...hp?f=1&t=175295

 

Lincoln has an PDF application form for the PDP that Coolstavi included in an email to me. It’s not possible to include the PDF in a posting here or on the BH forum. The form is specifically for the PDP, either a 403b or a 457, both either traditional or Roth. 

 

Dave Grant, you’ve mentioned Lincoln Investment several times. Can you tell us more about this Lincoln plan? 

 



#2 tony

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Posted 22 December 2016 - 06:03 PM

Yes Dave mentioned this earlier. When folks mentioned  Lincoln, I always thought they were talking about Lincoln Insurance Company.  Lincoln Investments seems to be a totally different company. Don't get the two mixed up. One is an Insurance high fee annuity peddler and the other seems to be a much better option.

 

Dave?

 

 

Tony



#3 davegrant82

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Posted 22 December 2016 - 11:58 PM

This PDP is really interesting, I wasn't aware that Lincoln had one. In knowing there is a self-directed platform, I may ask clients if they still want a rep tied to their account to direct trading and account management (which costs between 0.8-0.9%) or if they'd rather save this money and go it alone.

 

Lincoln Investment Planning is my main go-to 403(b)/457 company when clients do not want to self-direct, or don't have great options in their district. They have a wide open mutual fund platform including Vanguard Admiral shares (as mentioned above) but also going into other passive families and active funds as well. I even had the rep I use for clients open up the Vanguard Target Date Retirement Funds for clients whose account size doesn't require a portfolio to be built.

 

It's obviously not a perfect platform but when you're comparing it to an annuity product, it's a lot better.



#4 krow36

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Posted 23 December 2016 - 02:09 PM

I guess we can say that most mutual fund based 403b win hands down over an annuity based 403b (except for TIAA?). I think this  Participant Directed Platform (PDP) should be compared to Lincoln Investment’s Retirement Solutions Premier Platform which adds on a Mgmt/Wrap fee of 0.90% (and uses a smaller (but adequate) selection of Vanguard funds).  The Retirement Solutions Premier doesn’t include an advisor—that’s an additional 0.60%. So the PDP like the RS Premier plan is a very bare-bones DIY plan. The PDP is a DIY way to use rock-bottom low cost mutual funds in a 403b and/or a 457. There’s no hand-holding, no website explaining the basics of investing like we see with the CalSTRS Pension 2 or the NYSDCP 457 and some (all too few) plans. 

 

Because Lincoln Investment is widely available throughout the US, this plan could be a big help in many school districts with no low-cost providers such as Vanguard, Fidelity, TIAA or Aspire (if Lincoln Investment is on the district’s list). Being able to use Vanguard funds in a 457 plan would be a welcome improvement for many districts. Lincoln hasn’t made the PDP easily available by putting the application form on their website, making a phone call and email necessary to get started. Maybe this will change?



#5 krow36

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Posted 19 January 2017 - 09:03 PM

Here’s an example of a recent post on this forum where there was no obvious low-cost  provider of index funds. 

SPerk15, http://board.403bwise.com/index.php?showtopic=6215  

Here are my options:

 

Ameriprise Financial

AXA Equitable

Great American Life Insurance Company

Lincoln Investment Planning

MetLife

Thriven Financial for Lutherans

VALIC Financial Advisers

 

 

Several of us suggested checking out Lincoln Investment and VALIC. Here is what 403bcompare shows for a large cap index fund:

Lincoln’s Premier Mgmt/Wrap fee of 0.90% added to Vanguard’s Total Stock Mkt Investor’s ER of 0.16%. Total fund fee 1.06% + $60

VALIC’s Inside Edge Recordkeeping Fee of 0.40% added to their Stock Index (SunAmerica) funds ER of 0.34%. Total fund fee 0.75% + $30

VALIC’s Group MF variable (0 to 1.0%) Mgmt/Wrap fee of perhaps 0.60% to a Dreyfus S&P 500 fund with ER of 0.50%. Total fund fee 1.10%

 

We weren’t aware of the DIY Lincoln plan at the time SPerk15 asked about his district’s vendor list. 

Lincoln’s Participant Directed Platform no Mgmt/Wrap fee, VG Total Stock Mkt Admiral fund with ER of 0.05%. Total fund fee 0.05% +$60

 

Sperk15 hasn’t returned and hasn’t responded to a PM suggesting he take a look at this thread. Maybe he was successful getting a low-cost provider signed up to his district’s list? If not, the Lincoln PDP plan looks like his best option for a 403b and probably also for a 457.



#6 tony

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Posted 19 January 2017 - 09:14 PM

Krow

 

Over the years we have had several Hit and Run posters. We never know if they came back to get new information or not. We just have to hope they did and just didn't bother to thank us. Yes some time ago many of us were not aware that Lincoln's direct platform was an option worth considering.



#7 krow36

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Posted 19 January 2017 - 09:34 PM

Yeah, hit and runs are also happen on the BH forum especially if they aren't quickly engaged. Oh well, bringing it up gives me another chance to bring it to folks' attention. And you never know who's looking.



#8 jebjebitz

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Posted 30 May 2017 - 03:40 PM

Just wanted to post here to say thank you to krow. I received advice from you on the BH forum and was able to switch to Lincoln's PDP. I'm out of AXA and have learned a lot about the steps I need to take next by reading the advice on the BH Wiki pages. I'm in NJ which allowed me to take advantage of the Lincoln plan. I was directed to the paperwork after a few calls and worked with an agent through email and phone calls when they needed to guide me through some of the process.
I asked about fees and they confirmed that I woul pay a $60.00 custodial fee plus the expense ratios on the funds I chose. They also explained that this program was fairly new to them and they were required to offer it by law. There's no way to change assets online or anything yet but they did provide me with a ######line. 1-800-242-1421 ext.4500
Anyway, I can share more about the process of how I switched providers if anyone is interested. I also felt compelled to stand up at my last faculty meeting to inform people about 403b compare and the effects of expense ratios on their investments. Most teachers in my district are with AXA. Thanks again for all the information

#9 EdLaFave

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Posted 30 May 2017 - 04:36 PM

I am very interested in hearing exactly how you signed up, links to read details about the plan, the available investment options, how you view/manage the account, fee breakdown, etc...basically all of the information somebody would need to evaluate the plan. Their website is abysmal and I cant find any concrete information.

If this is a quality plan then I'd like to include it on my website to help people find it.


Navigate and reform OCPS' 403b and 457b.

#10 chaka_han

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Posted 30 May 2017 - 05:24 PM

I may be wrong, but I was under the impression that Lincoln's PDP was only offered in specific locations and was not necessarily available in all states. Since they make it so hard to find information about it, no one seems to have a definitive answer. 



#11 EdLaFave

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Posted 30 May 2017 - 05:31 PM

chaka_han it looks like you're right. From the boglehead thread krow linked to:

 

MtDewAddict wrote:

 

A contact at Lincoln informed me the DIY program has extremely limited availability (New Jersey, Chicago SD, Philadelphia SD and possibly one on the west coast). So it’s off to Security Benefit we go.

 

Krow36 wrote:

 

POSTERS SIGNED UP WITH THIS 403B/457 PLAN:

A440, since Oct 2015, NJ
coolstavi, since Nov? 2016, IL
ValleyBreeze, since Dec 2016, unknown state
GrandMasterBlaster, available, NY

Navigate and reform OCPS' 403b and 457b.

#12 jebjebitz

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Posted 30 May 2017 - 08:51 PM

I am very interested in hearing exactly how you signed up, links to read details about the plan, the available investment options, how you view/manage the account, fee breakdown, etc...basically all of the information somebody would need to evaluate the plan. Their website is abysmal and I cant find any concrete information.

If this is a quality plan then I'd like to include it on my website to help people find it.

I initially learned about the Lincoln PDP in the BH discussion forum when I started a thread about being a public teacher in need of help with my 403b.  That discussion can be seen here: https://www.boglehea...328867#p3328867

Within that discussion it was mentioned that other teachers had taken advantage of the plan and it was offered in NJ.  more information on that can be found in this thread:  https://www.boglehea...332081#p3332081

 

I called the number provided by my school district for Lincoln Investments.   This number led me to the rep that handles all accounts in our district.  I informed him that I wanted to enroll in the Participant Directed Platform and he gave me a number and email of the person who would help me throughout the process.

 

I was emailed paperwork that included a list of funds I would have access to.  From there, I worked with the customer service rep from Lincoln who assisted me with the transfer of funds from AXA to Lincoln.  The rep was very helpful and was available through email or by phone.  

 

I created an account with Lincoln online and I am able to view my funds and allocation.  It is very limited in terms of what I can do with online.  Like I listed above, when I asked about reallocating my assets the rep explained that I would not have the capability to do this online and that I would have to call the number listed above.  

 

Here are the funds available: ( listed in order of conservative to aggressive)


Vanguard Prime Money Market. Investor
Vanguard Short Term Bond Index. Admiral
Vanguard Short Term Federal Admiral
Vanguard Short Term Investment Grade. Admiral
Vanguard Short Term Treasury Admiral
Vanguard Short Term Infl - Prot - Sec - Idx. Admiral
Vanguard Total Bond Market Index. Admiral
Vanguard Ultra Short Term Bond. Admiral
Vanguard GNMA. Admiral
Vanguard Inflation Protected Secs. Admiral
Vanguard Interm Term Investment Grade. Admiral
Vanguard Interm Term Treasury Admiral
Vanguard LifeStrategy Conserve Gr. Admiral
Vanguard LifeStrategy Income. Investor
Vanguard Market Neutral. Investor 
Vanguard Target Retirement 2010. Investor
Vanguard Target Retirement Income. Investor
Vanguard Wellesley Income. Admiral
Vanguard Balanced Index Admiral
Vanguard High Yield Corporate Admiral
Vanguard Interim Term Bond Index Admiral
Vanguard LifeStrategy Moderate Gr Investor
Vanguard STAR Investor
Vanguard Target Retirement 2015 Investor
Vanguard Target Retirement 2020 Investor
Vanguard Total Intl Bond Idx Admiral
Vanguard LifeStrategy Growth Investor
Vanguard Long-Term Bond Index Investor
Vanguard Long Term Investment Grade Admiral
Vanguard Long Term Treasury Admiral
Vanguard Managed Payout Investor
Vanguard Target Retirement 2025 Investor
Vanguard Target Retirement 2030 Investor
Vanguard Target Retirement 2035 Investor
Vanguard Target Retirement 2040 Investor
Vanguard Target Retirement 2045 Investor
Vanguard Target Retirement 2050 Investor
Vanguard Target Retirement 2055 Investor
Vanguard Target Retirement 2060 Investor
Vanguard 500 Index Admiral
Vanguard Capital Value Investor
Vanguard Developed Markets Idx Admiral
Vanguard Diversified Equity Investor
Vanguard Dividend Appreciation Idx Investor
Vanguard Dividend Growth Investor
Vanguard Emerg Mkts Govt Bd Idx Admiral
Vanguard Emerg Mkts Sel Stk Investor
Vanguard Emerging Mkts Stock Idx Admiral
Vanguard Energy Admiral
Vanguard Equity Income Admiral
Vanguard European Stock Index Admiral
Vanguard Explorer Admiral
Vanguard Explorer Value Investor
Vanguard Extended Market Idx Admiral
Vanguard FTSE All World Ex US SmCp Idx Investor
Vanguard FTSE All World Ex US Index Admiral
Vanguard FTSE Social Index Investor
Vanguard Global Equity Investor
Vanguard Global Ex US Rel Est Indx Admiral
Vanguard Global Minimum Volatility Investor
Vanguard Growth & Income Admiral
Vanguard Growth Index Admiral
Vanguard Health Care Admiral
Vanguard High Dividend Yield Index Investor
Vanguard International Explorer Investor
Vanguard International Growth Admiral
Vanguard International Value Investor
Vanguard Large Cap Index Admiral
Vanguard Mid Cap Growth Investor
Vanguard Mid Cap Index Admiral
Vanguard Mid Cap Growth Index Admiral
Vanguard Mid Cap Growth Value Index Admiral
Vanguard Morgan Growth Admiral
Vanguard Pacific Stock Index Admiral
Vanguard Precious Metals and Mining Investor
Vanguard REIT Index Admiral
Vanguard Selected Value Investor
Vanguard Small Cap Growth Index Admiral
Vanguard Small Cap Index Admiral
Vanguard Small Cap Value Index Admiral
Vanguard Strategic Equity Investor
Vanguard Strategic Small Cap Equity Investor
Vanguard Total Intl Stock Index Admiral
Vanguard Total Stock Mkt Index Admiral
Vanguard Total World Stock Index Investor
Vanguard US Growth Admiral
Vanguard US Value Investor
Vanguard Value Index Admiral
Vanguard Windsor II Admiral
Vanguard Windsor Admiral



#13 EdLaFave

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Posted 30 May 2017 - 09:29 PM

Thanks, I guess I'll give them a call to see if it is available here in Florida. Sounds unlikely.


Navigate and reform OCPS' 403b and 457b.

#14 krow36

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Posted 30 May 2017 - 10:07 PM

jebjebitz, thanks very much for posting about your experience with the Lincoln DIY platform! It’s certainly interesting to learn that it’s required by law in NJ!? I wish we had the back story on that one. 

 

Lincoln has certainly kept it under cover, with nothing specific on the internet. The only info on this option is on the application form which they require be emailed from a regional office. Of course if you haven’t seen the application form, you don’t know if the plan is worth pursuing! As mentioned in the original post, I will email the PDF link if contacted by PM, so that the plan can be checked out. The regional office should still be contacted for approval (and the PDF) because I think Lincoln does restrict where the plan is offered. I’ll try to keep the list of the plan’s users updated on A440’s thread.

 

Lincoln did raise the fees on their offerings recently. Retirement Solutions Premier Platform now charges $60/yr and 1.25%, up from $35/yr and 0.9% (and uses Vanguard Investor class funds). The Participant Directed Platform went from $35/yr to $60/yr (allows Vanguard Admiral class).



#15 jebjebitz

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Posted 06 June 2017 - 07:44 AM

jebjebitz, thanks very much for posting about your experience with the Lincoln DIY platform! It’s certainly interesting to learn that it’s required by law in NJ!? I wish we had the back story on that one. 

 

Lincoln has certainly kept it under cover, with nothing specific on the internet. The only info on this option is on the application form which they require be emailed from a regional office. Of course if you haven’t seen the application form, you don’t know if the plan is worth pursuing! As mentioned in the original post, I will email the PDF link if contacted by PM, so that the plan can be checked out. The regional office should still be contacted for approval (and the PDF) because I think Lincoln does restrict where the plan is offered. I’ll try to keep the list of the plan’s users updated on A440’s thread.

 

Lincoln did raise the fees on their offerings recently. Retirement Solutions Premier Platform now charges $60/yr and 1.25%, up from $35/yr and 0.9% (and uses Vanguard Investor class funds). The Participant Directed Platform went from $35/yr to $60/yr (allows Vanguard Admiral class).

I can confirm that all the information you have listed on the fees for the PDP are accurate.  I spoke with one of the reps last week just trying to see if there was more information available to the public.  As you listed above, all of the information that is currently available can be found on the PDF application.  The rep was very helpful and explained that this particular plan was for NJEA members.  He also explained that there are a handful of reps that handle calls related to the PDP and can help customers make changes to their account if necessary.